[xx1943]

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Do you have a tool to find the double-fit in the blacks after 1NT OR 1♦(playing weak NT)?
Would you with your favorite Partner find this 100% slam?

[Cyberyeti]

1N-2♥
3♠(4 spades minimum)-4♣
4♥-4N
5♠-6♠

it looks like partner has nothing much wasted in diamonds which he failed to cue, so good chance of K♣

1♦-1♠
2♠-3♣(LSGT or better)
3♥(accept, extras, cue)-3♠
4♣(cue)-4N
5♠-6♠

2♠ shows 4 much more often than it would for most people, we're happy to rebid 1N with 15+ and 3 spades balanced, and of course the weak notrump takes out a lot of 3 card raises.

A lot of weak no trump acol pairs would open the S hand 1♠ which should make it really easy

[TWO4BRIDGE]

xx1943, on 2014-October-03, 15:27, said:

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Do you have a tool to find the double-fit in the blacks after 1NT OR 1♦(playing weak NT)?
Would you with your favorite Partner find this 100% slam?

If you don't super-accept with a minimum NT hand, it could go like this :

1NT - 2H!
2S - 3C ( 2nd suit, 4+ cards, GF )
??
A new suit ( 3D! ) would agree ♣, so a 4C bid is idle.. so why not have it agree BOTH ?

4C! ( double fit ) - 4NT ( 6Ace-RKC ♠& ♣ but ♠ is the preferred fit)
5C ( 0/3 ) - 5D ( ♠Q-ask )
5N ( ♠Q ; no outside K ) - 6S

EDIT: I probably should have some cue bidding after 4C! :
4C! - 4D
4H - thennn 4NT

This post has been edited by TWO4BRIDGE: 2014-October-03, 17:33

[mikeh]

In standard (for NA) bidding, with strong 1N and super-accept requiring extras plus 4 trump:


1N 2♥
2♠ 3♣
3♠ 4♣
4♥ ?

2♥ transfer

3♣ natural, 4+, game force values

3♠ maximum hand for spades, given that no superaccept was offered. 3 red would (for most) be a probe for 3N, becoming a cue for clubs only if opener pulled 3N or if opener continued cooperating. Note that whatever 3 red means, it denies 3+ spades.

4♣ slam try, cuebid

4♥ cue bid, denies diamond A or K.


Responder now has several choices.

It is important to bear in mind that opener, in cuebidding below game, is expressing a liking for his hand. He is unlikely to be cooperating with no diamond control unless he has the club K. However he might hold, say, KQxx AKQx Jxx Jx, since responder is unlimited and might hold AJ10xx xx x AKxxx or the like, and need the heart cue.

Thus I would not keycard...I would seek more cooperation by cuebidding 5♦ which is not a slam force and conveys a need for working cards rather than number of keycards.

As opener, I would love my clubs and would bid 6♣. Now if opener held AJxxx x Ax AQxxx he can bid 7 with some comfort.

I know, most will be aghast at bidding a slam, let alone a grand, without asking for keycards.

So if you don't trust your partnership to use judgment, have responder keycard over 4♥. It may be a bit much for intermediates to use 6 card keycard, but if there were ever a situation to use it, it is when one partner has opened 1 or 2NT and the other shows a 2-suiter. Now, it is trivial to bid small slam.

4N 5♦0 or 3
5♥ any Queens in our suits?

5♠ would deny, 5N would be one, 6♣ 2 with no red King, 6♦ 2 with diamond K, etc.

[mike777]

xx1943, on 2014-October-03, 15:27, said:

---

Do you have a tool to find the double-fit in the blacks after 1NT OR 1♦(playing weak NT)?
Would you with your favorite Partner find this 100% slam?

hard to stop after super accept.

perhaps:

1nt=2h
3h=4c
4h=4nt
5s=6s

3h=super accept
4h=cue,,deny d cue

[kenrexford]

I agree with everything Mike said, except for the 6C call, which is horrible IMO. Sounds like.three spades and four clubs and an offer to play the safer slam. If I were to invite a grand, I would bid 6D. I already denied a diamond control. 6D has to be a Bluhmer, I think.

[mikeh]

kenrexford, on 2014-October-03, 18:46, said:

I agree with everything Mike said, except for the 6C call, which is horrible IMO. Sounds like.three spades and four clubs and an offer to play the safer slam. If I were to invite a grand, I would bid 6D. I already denied a diamond control. 6D has to be a Bluhmer, I think.

with 3=4 blacks, offering the better slam choice, I bid 5N, not 6♣

responder is unlimited, I am merely cue-bidding. No need to invent bids when normal methods deal with all possibilities

[bluechip10]

xx1943, on 2014-October-03, 15:27, said:

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Do you have a tool to find the double-fit in the blacks after 1NT OR 1♦(playing weak NT)?
Would you with your favorite Partner find this 100% slam?

Assuming South opens and no interference:

1NT--2♥
2♠--3♣
3♠--4NT
5♠--6♠

[Cyberyeti]

bluechip10, on 2014-October-04, 08:32, said:

Assuming South opens and no interference:

1NT--2♥
2♠--3♣
3♠--4NT
5♠--6♠

This is clear knowledge of the hand, partner actually had the red suits reversed and they cashed 2 hearts.

[kenrexford]

mikeh, on 2014-October-04, 07:50, said:

with 3=4 blacks, offering the better slam choice, I bid 5N, not 6♣

responder is unlimited, I am merely cue-bidding. No need to invent bids when normal methods deal with all possibilities

Do you not realize how stupid that sounds. I bid 6C natrually, inventing strange bids ti find remote grands. You claim the normal method of bidding 5NT to get to 6C the long way, so that you can bid 6C artificially.

[mikeh]

kenrexford, on 2014-October-04, 17:55, said:

Do you not realize how stupid that sounds. I bid 6C natrually, inventing strange bids ti find remote grands. You claim the normal method of bidding 5NT to get to 6C the long way, so that you can bid 6C artificially.

You're in danger of becoming a parody of yourself......read what you wrote about inventing a bluhmer.

[kenrexford]

mikeh, on 2014-October-04, 19:45, said:

You're in danger of becoming a parody of yourself......read what you wrote about inventing a bluhmer.

I may be simple here, but I have a general rule that a bid at the six level in a suit that's in focus is not a cuebid. I also tend to not find controls that I didn't have earlier.

What the hell else could 6D mean?

[akwoo]

Playing weak NT, I get pretty much the same as Cyberyeti. It helps to be playing well-defined long suit game tries with an explicit double fit response.

1♦ - 1♠
2♠ (1) - 3♣ (2)
4♣ (3) - 4♦
4♥ - 4N
5♠ - 6♠

(1) A raise to 2♠ is, if balanced, any hand that would not super-accept a transfer if opening a strong NT. If unbalanced, it's good11-bad14, usually with a singleton. (1N can include 2 doubletons, subject to judgement.) So South is not particularly strong for the 2♠ raise.
(2) game try with 4+♣, with 2 or more of the top 4 honors. (We also have short suit game tries available when the long suit is weaker.)
(3) Acceptance of the game try with QJx♣ or better (the standard is good chance of 4 tricks in ♣ opposite partner's worst possible ♣ holding).

This is still somewhat of a challenge at the table. North needs to make the inference that South has at most 2 hearts to make the 4N bid. (Give South 2 low hearts instead of 2 low diamonds and slam is under 50%.) On a good day I'd figure it out, but not on a bad one.

[PhilG007]

xx1943, on 2014-October-03, 15:27, said:

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Do you have a tool to find the double-fit in the blacks after 1NT OR 1♦(playing weak NT)?
Would you with your favorite Partner find this 100% slam?

1NT 3♣
3NT 4♠
South should now use RKCB and 6♠ should be reached comfortably.

[Cyberyeti]

PhilG007, on 2014-October-05, 00:56, said:

1NT 3♣
3NT 4♠
South should now use RKCB and 6♠ should be reached comfortably.

Again, how does this auction differ if N has his red suits the other way round and you're off 2 cashers.

[whereagles]

I can find slam on a pet system

pass 1♠
2NT 3♦

pass = 0-8 or 15+ forcing.
1♠ = 9-14 natural.
2NT = ask singleton. Should be easy from there on.

Playing a more normal system I don't think I could reach it, regardless of opening 1NT or 1♦.

[msjennifer]

bluechip10, on 2014-October-04, 08:32, said:

Assuming South opens and no interference:

1NT--2♥
2♠--3♣
3♠--4NT
5♠--6♠

This is what was known as "Papa- Mamma" bridge bidding and very clearly made on the full sight of all 52 cards.

[msjennifer]

I open the biddable 4 card major if the hand contains 10 plus HCP in any two suits with one side suit wide open,although it contains 15 /17 points.
1S-2C
3C-3D(forcing and may be made with many types.Partner takes it as showing no guard in Hearts.
3NT-4D (all purpose cue bid)
4H Cue heart Ace.3NT earlier showed a double guard in heart suit.With a single guard he bids 3 hearts and 4 clubs with none,
Now a jump to 6 Spades is very reasonable.

[kenrexford]

I mean, this is actually rather simple.

After a transfer and then a new suit, a fairly simple approach is for Responder, after the major is agreed, to bid 3NT if he wants cues or shortness otherwise. (Actually, 3M+1 for cues.)

With discussion, that's my preference. I usually add a void option. 3M+1 asks for cues, 3M+2 as a void relay, 3M+3 as low stiff, and 3M+4 as high stiff.

[jddons]

xx1943, on 2014-October-03, 15:27, said:

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Do you have a tool to find the double-fit in the blacks after 1NT OR 1♦(playing weak NT)?
Would you with your favorite Partner find this 100% slam?

If you can't open 1N or 1S on this hand, then 1C is much preferable to 1D. 40+ years ago Terence Reece wrote "don't bid bad suits on good hands". If partner can rely on you opening decent suits, (s)he is better placed to evaluate singletons opposite potentially wasted values.