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Save?

#1 User is offline   gnasher 

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Posted 2013-March-07, 02:46



What do you do, and is it close?

Would you have done anything different on the previous round? 2NT would have been a mixed 4-card raise, 3♣ and 3♠ would have been high-card raises, and 4♦ would have been a fit bid.
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
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#2 User is offline   Codo 

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Posted 2013-March-07, 03:56

Not too close to bid 5 ♥, pass is the second choice, but with at most one trick in defence and a passing partner...
I had bid 4 ♥ too, my hand looks nearly like a prototype for this bid.
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Roland

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More system is not the answer...
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#3 User is offline   rhm 

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Posted 2013-March-07, 04:01

Yes

Rainer Herrmann
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#4 User is offline   Trinidad 

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Posted 2013-March-07, 05:04

I would play partner for something like a 3523 with 9 HCPs. On defense, I can see a spade trick and a heart, and partner may have a trick in one of the minors, meaning that 4♠ will make. On offense, I see a spade loser and 3 or 4 losers in the minors, meaning that 5♥ will be down 2 or 3.

So, yes, I would save. No guarantees, since partner might hold: ♠QTxx ♥AJxxx ♦x ♣Kxx. But if you want guarantees, you shouldn't play bridge.

Rik
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#5 User is offline   PeterAlan 

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Posted 2013-March-07, 07:01

I probably don't belong in this forum, but I'm wishing I'd bid 5♥ on the previous round and left the last guess with the opposition.
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#6 User is offline   Trinidad 

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Posted 2013-March-07, 10:53

View PostPeterAlan, on 2013-March-07, 07:01, said:

I probably don't belong in this forum, but I'm wishing I'd bid 5♥ on the previous round and left the last guess with the opposition.

In general, that is a good tactic.

In this case, however, LHO doesn't need to do much guessing. RHO has described his hand pretty accurately. LHO will know precisely what to do whether we bid 5♥ now or in the previous round. As soon as we get the explanation of 2♠, we know that we will be doing the guessing on this hand.

Rik
I want my opponents to leave my table with a smile on their face and without matchpoints on their score card - in that order.
The most exciting phrase to hear in science, the one that heralds the new discoveries, is not “Eureka!” (I found it!), but “That’s funny…” – Isaac Asimov
The only reason God did not put "Thou shalt mind thine own business" in the Ten Commandments was that He thought that it was too obvious to need stating. - Kenberg
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#7 User is offline   billw55 

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Posted 2013-March-07, 11:22

Form of scoring might matter. I think it is an easy save at matchpoints. Not as confident at IMPs but I probably would still do it at these colors.
Life is long and beautiful, if bad things happen, good things will follow.
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#8 User is offline   JLOGIC 

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Posted 2013-March-07, 11:32

Yeah I'd save at MP and not at imps
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#9 User is offline   FrancesHinden 

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Posted 2013-March-07, 12:29

I probably would have bid 4D last round, but I think it's close, it might encourage partner to save too often.
Now I pass, assuming it's imps.
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#10 User is offline   aguahombre 

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Posted 2013-March-07, 12:43

View PostTrinidad, on 2013-March-07, 10:53, said:

As soon as we get the explanation of 2♠, we know that we will be doing the guessing on this hand.

True. And with the OP conditions about the alternatives available, we seem to have chosen the right bid to allow partner to do the guessing. We have a surprise spade King to offset the surprise fifth diamond, so I will gamble our matchpoints or IMPs on partner having made the successful choice.
"Bidding Spades to show spades can work well." (Kenberg)
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#11 User is offline   han 

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Posted 2013-March-07, 12:59

I like 4D on the previous round.
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.

- hrothgar
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#12 User is offline   aguahombre 

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Posted 2013-March-07, 13:12

Are there normally some suit quality expectations for a fit jump?
"Bidding Spades to show spades can work well." (Kenberg)
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#13 User is offline   chasetb 

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Posted 2013-March-07, 13:21

I don't know how others plays a FSJ, but I play it as 2 of the top 3, or AJT/AJ9, so I wouldn't even consider 4♦. I see that Frances and han both went with that option though.
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#14 User is offline   Free 

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Posted 2013-March-07, 13:46

View Posthan, on 2013-March-07, 12:59, said:

I like 4D on the previous round.

I don't like the suit quality, and with partner on lead it's quite dangerous imo.
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#15 User is offline   lalldonn 

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Posted 2013-March-07, 13:47

I hate 4♦. I'm fine with 4♥ and then making our decision next round, well perhaps fine is an overbid but I'm satisfied that I don't like anything else better. I don't think 4♦ will generally help partner make a better decision at all. For example he might double with a singleton diamond which is really not much of a contribution to our defensive prospects here.
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#16 User is offline   PhilKing 

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Posted 2013-March-07, 15:10

I would bid 5♥. I doubt there is much in it either way, but say we faced this position 4 times and the results were -500 (win 3) -650 (flat) -300 (win 8) -500 (lose 12) I would suggest that was a fairly unlucky sequence.

I don't think they will go down as often one time in four, we will go for 300 more than one time in three, and occasionally they will push to 5♠ down one.
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#17 User is offline   aguahombre 

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Posted 2013-March-07, 15:39

Can't we improve on those numbers by (having shown what we hold) letting partner do her own math and make the choice?
"Bidding Spades to show spades can work well." (Kenberg)
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#18 User is offline   PhilKing 

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Posted 2013-March-07, 15:41

View Postaguahombre, on 2013-March-07, 15:39, said:

Can't we improve on those numbers by (having shown what we hold) letting partner do her own math and make the choice?


Yes! We can designate that 4♥ shows exactly these 13 cards - that should do it. Now partner will know to sacrifice with ♠xxx ♥AJxxx ♦xx ♣Kxx. You can add the ♦Q or ♠Q or both and they will still make 4♠.

Sadly, we will have to disclose this fine agreement, and the opposition will simply push to 5♠ and drop our stiff king.
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#19 User is offline   aguahombre 

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Posted 2013-March-07, 15:59

That was a helpful answer and a well-chosen example of a hand where the choice by partner might be wrong or break even.
"Bidding Spades to show spades can work well." (Kenberg)
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#20 User is offline   PhilKing 

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Posted 2013-March-07, 16:02

View Postaguahombre, on 2013-March-07, 15:59, said:

That was a helpful answer and a well-chosen example of a hand where the choice by partner might be wrong or break even.


-300 versus 620. Glad I could help.
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