[inquiry]

Target audience: people wanting to create educational or other type of bridge content

Target category: general
Skill level: NOT applicable
i guess we need to create a forum for reviewing BBO Movie content, both the free kind, and the eventually the kind that might cost a BBO$ or two to read. I think it will be useful to include a link to any movie being reviewed, so if others like the review, they could get directly to the movie from this website.

The first one up will be the tutorial on how to use the software to create BBO movies. Since the movie file can be edited, of course any constructive critique might end up the file being "updated" to improve it.

The tutorial file is a straight forward, how-to do it thing that includes dozens of screen captures as well as text to walk people through the process of creating content for the BBO Movie page. It is only of use for members who want to create new content (description of a convention, bidding system notes, a wonderfully played hand, whatever). If you have no desire to create a new movie, then of course, there is no need to watch this movie.

Here is a direct link to the Tutorial: Creating BBO Bridge Movies

Please comment on how effective the tutorial is in demonstrating how to make a BBO movie, and add any comments on how it can be improved.

[Fluffy]

The tutorial is dense, before teaching people how to create movies you need to show some high quality movies to them so they feel the need to do the same, also that will get them familiar with some effects, reading the tutorial from raw was impossible for me.

[mr1303]

I couldn't move forward from one page to another. I'm using Google Chrome if it helps.

[barmar]

Fluffy, on 2012-November-15, 03:57, said:

The tutorial is dense, before teaching people how to create movies you need to show some high quality movies to them so they feel the need to do the same, also that will get them familiar with some effects, reading the tutorial from raw was impossible for me.

If you go to the BBO Store there are lots of existing movies to view.

[inquiry]

mr1303, on 2012-November-15, 08:45, said:

I couldn't move forward from one page to another. I'm using Google Chrome if it helps.

Curious, it works in chrome, firefox and ie for me. Anyone else having this problem? It is "graphics" heavy so it takes a little time to load (depending upon the speed of your connection).

IF you are interested in creating bbo movies (I think you could make great ones) it is really worth it to review how to use all the feature of the editing software. And it is especially important to review fred's suggestions and recommendation at the end of the presentation.

[inquiry]

Fluffy, on 2012-November-15, 03:57, said:

The tutorial is dense, before teaching people how to create movies you need to show some high quality movies to them so they feel the need to do the same, also that will get them familiar with some effects, reading the tutorial from raw was impossible for me.

There are a number of high quality movies to check out. I highly recommend the two thinking with Mike (by Mike Lawrence), these are Think with Mike and Thinking with Mike II, There are a lot of other good ones too, for instance, Deja Vu by Larry Cohen.

Take a look at those to see what a good movie might look like. I am fond of the thinking with mike II (REVIEW coming soon).

I do understand the critique that the tutorial is "dense". There are more than 100 frames (next pages) and a lot of content. It is meant for people who want to make movies using all or most all of the features of the movie creating software. Obviously few people would want to insert a hyperlink in their movie, or insert a picture or other "web content" from somewhere else. But the ability to do so is in the software and described. Few might want to "insert" a hand in the text area but the tutorial describes how to do that too.

For the record, the average person spends less than 4 minutes viewing that movie. They probably see only the first four to ten frames in that time period. I suspect they either fell like you do, or think the tutorial was about something related to playing bridge, and stop reading after that.

[Phil]

Ben, thanks for the time to set this up.

I was a little overwhelmed by the initial tutorial.

Maybe a 'quick start' primer would be better?

[barmar]

And the link to the BBO Store, where you can find all the published bridge movies, is http://www.bridgebas...store/index.php (you can get there from the BBO clients by clicking on BBO Movies).

[inquiry]

Phil, on 2012-November-15, 12:00, said:

Ben, thanks for the time to set this up.

I was a little overwhelmed by the initial tutorial.

Maybe a 'quick start' primer would be better?

There is a quick and dirty get started quide around from a few years ago when the movie editing software was being developed. Some of it is outdated, but it was short and quick. I could take a look at that and see what a quick start primer might look like and create something quick like that.

I know some of the movies that have shown up are poor, with all 52 cards being played at once, and consisting of just two or three frames (look what i did post). Of course those are not approved and the authors are given hints as to why (format). So people are not reading the tutorial. Eventually, however, people will want to create high quality ones, with voice, quizzes, web links, photos, other web content, highlighting cards (or suits), changing hands during play, backing up one or more tricks or cards played... etc. To do that kind of stuff, you really do have to read the tutorial, which is the audience the tutorial was meant for.

[diana_eva]

There are help files, a help index and help buttons for each and every effect that can be used in the movie maker. Ben's tutorial is dense because it covers the rest, it gives tips and tricks, styling guidelines etc. not just the basics. However for a quick start the Help buttons are just fine.

[Fluffy]

I didn't ever know that this feature existed :/, in fact I was planning to create a web site to do thing similar to this . I think the problem with this tutorial is that it is not a tutorial, its a guide that explains everything, on a tutorial you would step by step create a simple movie where you would face a simple bidding problem, and later observe that you can include a lot of fancy things in your movie such as sound, hyperlinks, card play and whatever else is left that I didn't see. Then yo would have a next tutorial with more advanced features and so on.

[inquiry]

Fluffy, on 2012-November-15, 15:29, said:

I didn't ever know that this feature existed :/, in fact I was planning to create a web site to do thing similar to this . I think the problem with this tutorial is that it is not a tutorial, its a guide that explains everything, on a tutorial you would step by step create a simple movie where you would face a simple bidding problem, and later observe that you can include a lot of fancy things in your movie such as sound, hyperlinks, card play and whatever else is left that I didn't see. Then yo would have a next tutorial with more advanced features and so on.

There is a small problem with this approach. The software you use to create the movies looks nothing like the movies that are eventually created. I think the best way to learn is similar to what you are describing. Get in, start making something, and when you run into a wall, ask someone. The movie thing was suppose to solve the ask someone. I am willing to help anyone who runs smack into a problem, and for you Fluffy, I am willing to help you specifically with the ones you wanted to create. Hands on help, however, is time consuming.

To create a simple movie... i think what might work is to open the editing software in one window, and the tutorial movie in another one. The "problem" is from within the the movie there are no frame controls, no insert quiz, etc.... Start creating a movie and bounce back and forth between the tutorial movie and the movie you are trying to create. The first 20 frames or so of the tutorial describe all the functions available to you... surely you will decide you want to do something and you can "bounce" forward and backwards to find a description of how the various functions work. I think just running through all the movie without getting in and trying some ot along the way is like trying to learn how to program in "C++" by reading a book on it without trying to write some code along the way.

[FM75]

I find it a bit tedious to navigate through page after page on the web. It might be very useful to create a pdf version that could be downloaded and either printed or viewed in whatever pdf reader one has. Then you can search through it readily.

Often I find it very useful to scan very quickly through manuals like what you have created to gain a quick overview of what types of options and features are available - yes sometimes laying on a couch or in bed.

Or maybe in a car ride or other situations where connectivity is unlikely.

The really good thing about this is that it nearly enforces good practice. How many smart bridge players have written truly awful books? You know, the kind with the hand diagram on the right page, and the description of play or the concept on the following left page. The publishing/editing of these is mind-boggling lazy/bad. The authors that do that well are the exception in the bridge publishing industry.

Have you thought about the idea of chapters, and "books". Right now it looks like the single song model that Apple started. If you go down the chapters/books route, then table of contents and an index or a text search might be very useful. Also bookmarking, so that one can return easily later.

[inquiry]

FM75, on 2012-November-15, 16:05, said:

Have you thought about the idea of chapters, and "books". Right now it looks like the single song model that Apple started. If you go down the chapters/books route, then table of contents and an index or a text search might be very useful. Also bookmarking, so that one can return easily later.

A pdf is possible, for instance, fairly easy with screen capture after screen capture and paste into a document.

The idea of chapters is really needed. It would help here along with an index... and I have several VERY LONG movies... the endplay one (with over 300 frames, and 14 bridge problems) and seven different chapters on squeezes with a dozen or so problem hands in each chapter. It is clear people would have to work through all of them, or return and start over. Chapters or bookmark is very high on a wish list, but the programmers are rightfully working on mobile version of the gaming software rather than the making changes to the movie editing software.

[Fluffy]

I saw on the italian forum a link to an alternative, there is an italian who I am not sure if runs tournaments or just reviews tourneys played, what he does for a movie is quite simple: he creates a teaching table with 4 ids of himself, and then simply records a video with his own voice playing the hand, undoing and reviewing different alternatives. He uploads the hands 3 by 3 to youtube.

[Fluffy]

inquiry, on 2012-November-15, 18:36, said:

The idea of chapters is really needed. It would help here along with an index... and I have several VERY LONG movies... the endplay one (with over 300 frames, and 14 bridge problems) and seven different chapters on squeezes with a dozen or so problem hands in each chapter. It is clear people would have to work through all of them, or return and start over. Chapters or bookmark is very high on a wish list, but the programmers are rightfully working on mobile version of the gaming software rather than the making changes to the movie editing software.

I haven't tried this already, but my impression is that you can solve this with hyperlinks.

With the hyperlink function this can be emulated, instead of a 300 frame movie divide your movie into different movies (chapters), and create a page with links to each chapter. Going forward and backward would be difficult though.

The hyperlink might also help you if you want to give some freedom to user, IE, he can decide to double 4♥ and then defend (wich has its own complications) or bid 4♠ and play there wich also has some complications, you can then split your movie into 2 depending on what the user picks on the hyperlink

[mr1303]

Apparently it's a google chrome thing that covers it up. I found the small x that I can press now to get rid of it.

[fromageGB]

inquiry, on 2012-November-15, 11:26, said:

For the record, the average person spends less than 4 minutes viewing that movie. They probably see only the first four to ten frames in that time period. I suspect they either fell like you do, or think the tutorial was about something related to playing bridge, and stop reading after that.

I probably spent 4 minutes without reaching the end. I have no desire to make movies, but was curious as to how comprehensive it seemed (very) and how complex or easy it would be (simple enough but would take practice). Seems a good idea at first glance.

[xx1943]

FM75, on 2012-November-15, 16:05, said:

I find it a bit tedious to navigate through page after page on the web. It might be very useful to create a pdf version that could be downloaded and either printed or viewed in whatever pdf reader one has. Then you can search through it readily.

Hi all

exactly that is my problem too. The tutorial is wonderful to get an impression of the capability of Fred's great software. BUT, when I started to write a movie myself, I missed a description on paper. To learn and work with a hardcopy is indispensable for me.

I tried, but was not successful (for several reasons - including my lack of knowledge) to copy and paste the pages to a pdf. So my questiom: Did someone this work and can provide me with a copy.

Many thanks

Al

[inquiry]

xx1943, on 2012-November-30, 08:28, said:

Hi all

exactly that is my problem too. The tutorial is wonderful to get an impression of the capability of Fred's great software. BUT, when I started to write a movie myself, I missed a description on paper. To learn and work with a hardcopy is indispensable for me.

I tried, but was not successful (for several reasons - including my lack of knowledge) to copy and paste the pages to a pdf. So my questiom: Did someone this work and can provide me with a copy.

Many thanks

Al

ATTACHED is a quick and dirty pdf made by cutting and pasting of the movie document. There is no index, keywords, etc.... and the titles from the various pages are lost. Maybe later, I will clean it up. If you can not download it for some reason, drop me an email at inquiry at bridgebase dot come and I will email it to you.

(it is not letting me attach it right now, i will ask barry why, as it is "only" 1.3 MB which is below the 2MB limit... and i have unlimited file attachments... but email me if you want it in the meanwhile.)

This post has been edited by inquiry: 2012-November-30, 17:57
Reason for edit: found problem... pdf was over 2MB after all... darn it all...