[mtvesuvius]

A friend of mine teaches beginning bridge. He asked me about the traditional advice for beginning players to count winning tricks in NT contracts and losing tricks in suit contracts, and how I counted when I declared. I answered him, and wondered how every else thinks in these situations. How do you approach this subject?

[kenrexford]

I generally count losers. One of my former partners thought that was stupid and counted winners. When we bid a slam, down one, we argued. I said I had enough covers. He insisted he had enough winners.

Later, we found out that he had a 14-card hand.

So, counting losers would work better in that situation.

[jdaming]

My biggest advice would be that the count needs to be a running total. In small contracts like 1NT I see newer players count initially then towards the end they "forget" how many tricks they have and how many they need. Sometimes different things will happen throughout the hand that will change your "count."

[fromageGB]

kenrexford, on Feb 18 2009, 08:22 PM, said:

Later, we found out that he had a 14-card hand.
So, counting losers would work better in that situation.

True. But counting winners is better if you have a 12 card hand : it prevents you going off in the grand

[Stephen Tu]

I think to get any good at the game you really have to learn to count both, in either NT or suit. At NT you have to see how many tricks the opps can take after they get in to see if you lose too many tricks and have to throw winners away. At suit if you don't count winning tricks the beginner can forget they have to ruff stuff and draw trumps too soon, or not see certain lines where you can score enough tricks and the losers combine themselves in the end game.

[mikeh]

Your friend gives the standard advice for teachers, as far as I can tell.

Personally, I do both at all forms of scoring and in all denominations. Whether I then try to play to minimize losers or generate winners depends upon the context. Sorry if that isn't much help.

[bid_em_up]

kenrexford, on Feb 18 2009, 02:22 PM, said:

Later, we found out that he had a 14-card hand.

So, counting losers would work better in that situation.

ummm, counting your cards would be the proper solution, no?

[jdonn]

You have to count both or else you are missing the boat. Notrump is tricky since it might be hard to tell how many tricks you will lose if you give up the lead.

Perhaps the first bridge advice I ever remember getting was from an 'expert' in a home game. He told me it's too hard to remember all the suits, so if you're a novice just count your trump suit or your longest suit, and when you become advanced you are able to keep track of two suits.

After that I stopped listening to people until I became friends with good players.

[Free]

Indeed, both! But in most cases losers in trumps and winners in NT will do just fine.

[mikestar]

Free, on Feb 19 2009, 05:51 PM, said:

Indeed, both!  But in most cases losers in trumps and winners in NT will do just fine.

Agreed with an important caveat as players advance--it is essential to count winners in a suit contract when dealing with a possible cross ruff.