[jillybean]

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Please tell me about the style of your weak 2's and how you plan to bid this.

[P_Marlowe]

I guess I will play 5D, -1.

I will bid 3D, and unless p bids 3NT, I will bid 5D.
If he bids 3NT I will pass, ..., unhappy but it is tossing a coin.
I was playing with my son, holding a 9 card suit, I passed 3NT, the
bidding was I opened 1D, rebidding 3D, he did bid correctly 3NT,
they cached lots of clubs, we did stop the major suits.

he was very upset of going -???, I understood it, I said it was my
fault / my decision, it did help a little.

[mw64ahw]

I have 3 criteria
a) I don't want to open at the 1-level
b) a 6/7 card suit (7-card suit if not enough playing tricks to preempt)
c) 9.5 mod. losers
My 2N asks for shape/strength with a weak response rebidding the suit. After that it's a punt as to whether I bid 3N, but almost guaranteed you'll get a ♠ lead
With shape being shown I hope to have the info. to place the contract.

[jillybean]

P_Marlowe, on 2025-July-30, 09:13, said:

I guess I will play 5D, -1.

I will bid 3D, and unless p bids 3NT, I will bid 5D.
If he bids 3NT I will pass, ..., unhappy but it is tossing a coin.
I was playing with my son, holding a 9 card suit, I passed 3NT, the
bidding was I opened 1D, rebidding 3D, he did bid correctly 3NT,
they cached lots of clubs, we did stop the major suits.

he was very upset of going -???, I understood it, I said it was my
fault / my decision, it did help a little.

Partner may have a spade stopper, will they bid 3nt without a club stopper? I do think it makes sense to bid 3nt without the a club stop but it's such a small target.

[P_Marlowe]

jillybean, on 2025-July-30, 10:08, said:

Partner may have a spade stopper, will they bid 3nt without a club stopper? I do think it makes sense to bid 3nt without the a club stop but it's such a small target.

He can also bid 3S showing spade values.
Over 3D he has to bid something, if he max and a semibal. hand, he can bid 3S to show spade values.
Maybe 3S showes doubt about 3NT. I did say, that I would be unhappy, but I would pass 3NT.

If you make the 3D bid, than you should know (*), what you do, after the most common responses.
You could also use feature ask 2NT or whatever 2NT is, ..., tell me partners hand, I will tell you
what kind of 2NT agreement would be helpful to ind out, what p has.

(*) This is similar to other thread, when you had to decide betweeen the overcall or T/O.
You dont need to plan for everything, but common responses from p should be taken into consideration
before you make the bid.

[P_Marlowe]

mw64ahw, on 2025-July-30, 09:32, said:

I have 3 criteria
a) I don't want to open at the 1-level
b) a 6/7 card suit (7-card suit if not enough playing tricks to preempt)
c) 9.5 mod. losers
My 2N asks for shape/strength with a weak response rebidding the suit. After that it's a punt as to whether I bid 3N, but almost guaranteed you'll get a ♠ lead
With shape being shown I hope to have the info. to place the contract.

The main problem I have with a 2NT feature ask bid is, that with max and a semibal. he may jump to 4H, and now it is anybodys gues,
if 5D over 4H is natural or a slam try.
If you know, what it means for your partnership and it is to play, fine, for us it would be a slam try.
It also will basically mean, even if p stops spade, the attack will be trough the spade stopper.
But having said this, 2NT can work out and may even be way better than 3D.

[mike777]

Pass

Hope to go plus in a major suit at MP

[Cyberyeti]

Happy to pass a weak only multi (2♥ would be Ekren)

Over 2♥ I would bid 3♦ and if partner doesn't bid 3♠ will prob bid 4♦.

[WasWinM]

I would bet a lot that 4D is the max on this hand. I’m bidding 3 then 4 diamonds and hope partner realizes this sequence isn’t forcing.

[shyams]

I will simply jump to 3NT (to play) and dare opening leader to find the correct defence.

Even if East has an Ace or two, it may be difficult for them to lead the Ace at trick 1 in order to have a look at dummy. Sometimes, such a "look" can cost a fair no. of IMPs to the defenders.

Sure, it's a gamble. However, given that other games may not be feasible, I think 3NT is the least bad option.

[jillybean]

This hand is part of a 'Learning to play Bridge' series, responding to a weak 2 bid.
On this hand, the author said 'bid 3D and make sure you have the agreement that new suits are forcing.' but didn't elaborate further.

[mycroft]

I didn't post - still working on my other one (it's much harder). ETA - done. It's crap, but it's done.

What I did think (playing with my "aggressive preempts" partner) is "2NT, 3NT if partner shows me a good hand. If partner shows me a good suit (and bad hand), maybe I pass (3♦), maybe I gamble 4♥."

3♦, "it's forcing" is a good answer, but it will get you past 3NT with a spade stopper and three diamonds, and after 2♥-3♦; 3♥ you're still basically in the soup.

Heh, with my "very conservative preempts" partner, it's "2NT" too; partner will bid 3NT with an outside feature :-).

But definitely it's "different tools for different preempt styles" territory.

[mikeh]

If we all think that 3N rates to be a terrible contract and that 5D is no better, how do we feel about playing in 2H? Ok, we have 17 hcp and 9 tricks in our own hand.

At imps, passing seems silly because….why?

Because it’s not quite 100% that they’ll lead spades and even if they do partner may have a stopper or may hold 3 and tge suit breaks 4=4 or it blocks. Of course if spades are 4=4 he needs the heart ace. What are the percentages here? I have no real idea but sum of all of these is probably 50% or close thereto and that makes game worth bidding even nv.

Doing anything other than 3N seems dubious to me. 2N will tell us nothing unless one is playing feature ask, which isn’t popular amongst good players (variants of Ogust seem more popular) and even a 3S response by him may not help…picture RHO doubling when LHO was going to lead from his QJ109 of clubs. And it’s not as if we’re going to know what to do over a ‘no feature’ 3H. 3D is imo a nothing bid. He isn’t going by 3H with most hands and he surely isn’t bidding 3N. If he’s going to bid 3S, then our bidding a direct 3N is going to work at least as well as 3D…better because RHO may be able to double 3S on something like AQxxx when his partner wasn’t leading the suit.

But at mps, I think it’s a different story. If I knew how to play in 3D, I’d never pass 2H. But I don’t, and tge one thing I’m fairly sure about is that 2H will score a plus a little more often than would 3N, and at mps plus scores are king.

Obviously we risk looking extremely silly if we pass, and nobody likes to look extremely silly. In truth, I’d bid 3N partly because I doubt many partners would truly understand pass and partly because I think 3N has decent chances. But I’d definitely respect someone who said pass, if they knew what they were doing. If one is passing, do it in tempo.unlikely though it may be, LHO may be balancing and we’re fairly happy if he does. That’s one way to get to play 3D, lol.

[DavidKok]

I agree with mikeh. 3NT at IMPs, no point in asking. At MP I bid 3♦ (NF), with pass in second place.

In a beginners book, and I'm only half joking, we should bid about 1-2 levels higher than what I expect to make opposite my own preempt style. We might even have a slam on! Opposite that style a pass is somewhere between 'questionable' and 'silly', and we'd have to bid.

[Huibertus]

2NT, asking for a feature. If partner bids 3♠ we'll play 3NT. if he bids anything else we're going to play 4♥ although passing 3♥ if he bids that could be right. But 4 cover cards and a doubleton that prevents them from cashing 3 ♠ is too much for me not to go to game. Without 3♠ (leading to 3NT) 5♦ makes no sense with 2 immediate ♠ losers and likely no place to discard a ♣ or♥ without losing the lead. So just hoping (yes potentially in vain) for 1 ♥ loser max and tempo to discard enough in 4♥ if partner doesn't bid 3♠.

[Cyberyeti]

Huibertus, on 2025-July-31, 02:58, said:

2NT, asking for a feature. If partner bids 3♠ we'll play 3NT. if he bids anything else we're going to play 4♥ although passing 3♥ if he bids that could be right. But 4 cover cards and a doubleton that prevents them from cashing 3 ♠ is too much for me not to go to game. Without 3♠ (leading to 3NT) 5♦ makes no sense with 2 immediate ♠ losers and likely no place to discard a ♣ or♥ without losing the lead. So just hoping (yes potentially in vain) for 1 ♥ loser max and tempo to discard enough in 4♥ if partner doesn't bid 3♠.

5♦ demands AKxxxx and out or AQxxxx and a finesse, and may be at least as good as 4♥, and that's without considering AJxxxx and the ♣Q or xx. I think the choice should be 3♥ or 5♦ or 3N rather than 4♥ and if partner has KQJ109x and out, unlucky

[WasWinM]

I don’t get why anyone expects a NV partner to hold more than KQJxxx of hearts and out. Isn’t it just wishful thinking opps won’t lead their 9-card fit, more so as RHO didn’t bid 2S and LHO will be on lead.

3N seems more like playing hold ‘em, raising with deuces, and hoping to flop a set.

[jillybean]

WasWinM, on 2025-July-31, 06:50, said:

I don’t get why anyone expects a NV partner to hold more than KQJxxx of hearts and out. Isn’t it just wishful thinking opps won’t lead their 9-card fit, more so as RHO didn’t bid 2S and LHO will be on lead.

3N seems more like playing hold ‘em, raising with deuces, and hoping to flop a set.

LOL Keep a straight face and put the 3nt card on the table with confidence. Isn't that part of the game?
We should start wearing hats and dark glasses at the table.

It's a torturous hand, I think most will gamble.

[DavidKok]

KQJxxx and out is a 3♥ opening at these colours and seating. I think partner can have quite a lot of hands both weaker or stronger, but not quite so pure.

Like I said though, if this is an instruction book I will drastically adjust my expectations to be more conservative.

[Cyberyeti]

DavidKok, on 2025-July-31, 09:02, said:

KQJxxx and out is a 3♥ opening at these colours and seating. I think partner can have quite a lot of hands both weaker or stronger, but not quite so pure.

Like I said though, if this is an instruction book I will drastically adjust my expectations to be more conservative.

Maybe to you (and possibly to me) but a lot of people do NOT consider 1st seat a gun preempting position