[JLilly]

Hi all,

For systems with six-card weak twos, the plurality treatment of openings of 2♦/♥/♠ in fourth seat seems to be to bump up the HCP requirement a bit, to 10~13 points. But if you open in ♦ or ♥, doesn't this cry out for your opponents to jump back in with a near-opening higher suit, knowing that the odds are that your side is relatively short in spades (and also hearts if you open 2♦)? The calculus for them is now (a) you likely have the fit and the points for a two-level partscore, so it's worth them competing even if they go down one or two, and (b) their odds of having a higher-suit fit are enhanced and so maybe they really should be in 2M.

Does anyone who normally plays standard six-card weak twos use a different structure for opening in fourth seat, based on showing spades / keeping opps from overcalling with spades? Something like:

2♠ = 6+ spades
2♥ = 5+ hearts and 4 spades; (or 6+ hearts and 5 spades)
2♦ = 5+ diamonds and 4 spades;
. . . . or perhaps the full three-suiter: (3)4+ diamonds, 4+ hearts, and 4 spades;
. . . . or maybe any 3-suiter with spades (is this GCC illegal if you want conventional responses like an asking 2NT or game-tries?)

Using the Rule of 15, the HCP requirements would be:

2♠ = 6+ spades 9-12 HCP
2♥ = 5+ hearts and 4 spades 11-14 HCP (by happenstance making this essentially Flannery 2H)
2♦ = 5+ diamonds and 4 spades; 11-14 HCP

The 5Y/4S distributions are about half as frequent as the 6Y distributions, but opening in fourth seat announcing that you're short in spades seems dangerous to me, especially if opps are NV.

[steve2005]

Your assumption that if you open 2♦/2♥ you will be short in ♥/ ♠ is flawed.
Yes opener is unlikely to have side 4-card major but can easily have 3 cards. Also, you can not make any assumption about opener's partner they can have most any number of cards though 6 or higher less likely.
Opener's side is not guaranteed to have a fit. If they were guaranteed a fit you would be protected by the law of total tricks for an action like a takeout double or an overcall.

Your method is not necessarily bad.

[The_Badger]

My take on this is play whatever you feel comfortable with, but as ♠ is the anchor (top) suit and two opponents have already passed, is there any point using the 2♦ or 2♥ bids as Flannery/Fantunes-styled bids with a four card ♠ suit in 4th? If you have a ♠ fit you have the top trump suit, and can't that be shown by normal methods?

I'm more in favour of 4th position 'weak twos' as intermediate weak twos 11-14(15) with a good six card suit and showing (at your discretion) maybe 3 out of 4 top honours, etc., and maybe bidding a tight game opposite a passed partner.