[eagles123]

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would a pass now from East be forcing? And how should the auction proceed? This was in a lesson so nothing disatarous happened, but I was East and chose to pass, thinking it was forcing and showed a hand somewhere between wanting to be in 5H and wanting to dbl 4S or even possibly going for 6H (I can't seriously want to leave 4S undoubled when I've bid freely to 4H vulnerable?)... according to teacher my only choices were dbl or 5H.

Just checking that I am getting correct info from teacher

Cheers,

Eagles

[Zelandakh]

Not forcing. West has shown nothing aside from a few hearts and East might just have a minimum overcall with extra heart length too. If you had wanted to establish a FP, you could have bid spades last time around.

[Phil]

Forcing for me. The colors and the delayed action indicate the opponents are clearly saccing.

This meets my "janitor" standard for FP.

[PhilKing]

Phil, on 2013-July-19, 09:45, said:

Forcing for me. The colors and the delayed action indicate the opponents are clearly saccing.

This meets my "janitor" standard for FP.

Oh, lol. My mentor for forcing passes is the barman.

[jillybean]

I am playing Neil Kimelman's FP, I am sure other BBF'ers have opinions on this and will express them but I have found
having these agreements is far superior to having none

It appears to be forcing, as in (ii) but as our auction started with a simple overcall I am not so sure.

Forcing pass (Neil Kimelman)
Forcing Pass Definition

When your partnership has made a bid that has created a game forcing auction, the opponents cannot play a contract undoubled.
1S (P) 2H (5D)


i) Besides hands where the partnership is in a game forcing auction, forcing pass also applies when one hand opens and the other hand shows at least invitational values.
1S (P) 3D* (5D)

ii) When your partnership bids game, and you are vulnerable versus nonvulnerable opponents.

V vs. NV (P) 1S (2H) 2S (4H) 4S (5H) ?

My partners and I play this is a forcing pass situation. At any other vulnerability it is not. This to me is a reasonable treatment, but may not be universal. The logic behind this agreement is that we should have extra values to bid game with a risk of being doubled for -200, -500 or more, versus 420 for the opponents.

iii) When the opponents preempt and your partnership bids game.
1H (3S) 4H (4S)

[eagles123]

Thanks guys, I see a mixed opinion!! My thought was the opponents are clearly sacrificing here, surely I can't be prepared to play in 4S undoubled, so pass would be forcing... but can see why it would be seen as NF

[wank]

to set up a forcing pass you need to have exhibited strength, e.g. by cueing the opps' suit. pushing onto game in a competitive auction doesn't show much in the way of high cards so for me it doesn't meet the criteria, irrespective of the vul.

[Fluffy]

My personal opinion is that having a simple set of rules such as jillybean is the best tactic at your level, on that context it would be a FP situation.

Thinking further, East had a 3♠ bid available to set up forcing pass later, he didn't use it, this means no FP is available.

But then, I also have the rule that when the opponents didn''t intend to make the contract they have just bid they shouldn't play it undoubled which means FP is on.