[jillybean]

The enforcement of ACBL's cell phone policy is unjust. While playing at the NABC in an Open Pairs event we had no less than 3 cell phones ringing during the event. The TD's made a joke of it, saying such things as "the next one to ring will be shot".

I also heard of another player receiving a full board penalty for the same offense in another event.

The wording of the policy seems to leave it up to the TD's judgement wether to apply a penalty or not. It must be uniformly applied or scrapped altogether. The electronic device is either on or off, present in the playing area or not.

4. Except for health related equipment or by permission of the DIC, cell phones, pagers, and all similar communications equipment may not be operated or operable in the playing area during a session of play at NABCs. Violations of this policy may be penalized without warning. Minimum penalties of one-quarter board for matchpointed events and three IMPs or one Victory Point for other events will be assessed if a player's cell phone or pager is audible or if a cell phone is being used in the playing area. Sponsoring organizations of other ACBL sanctioned events are strongly encouraged to adopt this policy

[billw55]

jillybean, on 2011-December-05, 19:54, said:

The enforcement of ACBL's cell phone policy is unjust. While playing at the NABC in an Open Pairs event we had no less than 3 cell phones ringing during the event. The TD's made a joke of it, saying such things as "the next one to ring will be shot".

I also heard of another player receiving a full board penalty for the same offense in another event.

The wording of the policy seems to leave it up to the TD's judgement wether to apply a penalty or not. It must be uniformly applied or scrapped altogether. The electronic device is either on or off, present in the playing area or not.

4. Except for health related equipment or by permission of the DIC, cell phones, pagers, and all similar communications equipment may not be operated or operable in the playing area during a session of play at NABCs. Violations of this policy may be penalized without warning. Minimum penalties of one-quarter board for matchpointed events and three IMPs or one Victory Point for other events will be assessed if a player's cell phone or pager is audible or if a cell phone is being used in the playing area. Sponsoring organizations of other ACBL sanctioned events are strongly encouraged to adopt this policy

Agree, with added emphasis in the rule.

It's an important rule at national level events, it would absurdly easy to text "board 16 slam" to a player in the room.

[TylerE]

A strict read of that would seem to state that IF a directory chooses to penalize, it's a minimum of quarter board/3 imps.

That said, dumb policy, should be rolled back, etc.

[barmar]

billw55, on 2011-December-05, 20:23, said:

It's an important rule at national level events, it would absurdly easy to text "board 16 slam" to a player in the room.

The rule quoted above is not for national level events. In those events, it's not allowed to have a cell phone at all, even if it's turned off.

Of course, enforcement of that is practically impossible -- they're not going to search pockets and purses. However, if someone is caught, I believe the penalty is more severe (maybe that's the full board penalty you heard about). They also make it harder to claim ignorance -- the entrances to all the playing areas for the NABC+ events have big signs saying "No electronic devices beyond this point", and there's a nearby table where you can check your phone.

[Elianna]

barmar, on 2011-December-05, 23:27, said:

The rule quoted above is not for national level events. In those events, it's not allowed to have a cell phone at all, even if it's turned off.

Of course, enforcement of that is practically impossible -- they're not going to search pockets and purses. However, if someone is caught, I believe the penalty is more severe (maybe that's the full board penalty you heard about). They also make it harder to claim ignorance -- the entrances to all the playing areas for the NABC+ events have big signs saying "No electronic devices beyond this point", and there's a nearby table where you can check your phone.

Even in the National level events, application of the rules is arbitrary. Adam and I have already told the story of a teammate's cellphone going off gave us a full-board penalty, while the cell phone of a different person going off in the same event only earned a 1/3 of a board penalty.

Also, when I was in a national room (I can't remember if it was when I was playing or kibitzing, so I can't state which event), I heard a cell phone go off and give a lot of rings, and a nearby director made no effort to find out whose cell phone it was (not that I really blame him, that is not the fun part of the job).

[barmar]

So bridge is similar to real life. Have you ever been caught by a traffic cop and given a warning? Is that fair to the people who got real tickets for the same offense? Do you complain about the capriciousness of traffic law enforcement?

The deterrent effect of rules like this comes from the potential penalty. As long as a sufficient number of players get the maximum penalty, there's the possibility that you might be one of them, so you should be careful. If some other players don't get the max penalty, what difference does that make to you? Were you planning on winning based on someone else getting a maximum cellphone penalty?

[BunnyGo]

barmar, on 2011-December-06, 00:11, said:

So bridge is similar to real life. Have you ever been caught by a traffic cop and given a warning? Is that fair to the people who got real tickets for the same offense? Do you complain about the capriciousness of traffic law enforcement?

1) Yes.

2) Yes, he is allowed to use his judgement. It would also have been fair for him to have given me a ticket for a blown out light.

3) Not usually.

4) BUT BRIDGE IS A GAME!! Do not conflate these situations. Games have rules and they must (should) be enforced as stated. In baseball, if an ump gets a call wrong this is a big deal. Same in soccer (for anyone who doesn't know baseball). It's not that these things don't happen, but within their abilities to rule correctly, we expect them to.

Police have lots of goals, primarily to maintain order and safety. If they can do this by not giving a ticket, they need not give a ticket.

[mycroft]

I did hear something that, while maybe not a cell-phone, was certainly electronic and a noisemaker, in the first session of the Blue Ribbon Pairs. I also heard later on that said noise did result in the full-board penalty.

When I'm playing I try not to pay attention to what the TDs are/should be doing; I guess I actually succeeded that time.

[Mbodell]

I heard a cell phone go off in day one of the blue ribbon pairs, and I saw a director hurrying in the room. Of course it was the director's phone and he was hurrying out of the playing area to answer it!

I know lots of folks brought their phones to the playing area. I left mine in the hotel room for the days I was playing NABC+ events.

There were penalties handed out in the Blue Ribbon finals, but I'm not sure if they are for slow play, cell phones, or something else.

The recap lists recap:
1/8 of a board penalties to:
David Berkowitz Alan Sontag
1/6 of a board penalties to:
Richard Wegman David Abelow
Walter Lee Alex Perlin
Cheryl Mandala Yul Inn
Kai Zhou Baixiang Liu
Gary Macgregor Robert Madalena
Allan Siebert Randy Pettit
1 full board penalties to:
Rita Bichara Krzysztof Martens

[jillybean]

Interesting, if a cell phone attracts a full board penalty in the Blue Ribbon I wonder what the other infractions were.
I can ask one of the pairs, they are local players.

[Elianna]

barmar, on 2011-December-06, 00:11, said:

So bridge is similar to real life. Have you ever been caught by a traffic cop and given a warning? Is that fair to the people who got real tickets for the same offense? Do you complain about the capriciousness of traffic law enforcement?

The deterrent effect of rules like this comes from the potential penalty. As long as a sufficient number of players get the maximum penalty, there's the possibility that you might be one of them, so you should be careful. If some other players don't get the max penalty, what difference does that make to you? Were you planning on winning based on someone else getting a maximum cellphone penalty?

If the cop were giving warnings to people who were his/her friends, or had donated a lot of money to the police ball, and only giving tickets to people he/she didn't like, then yes, I'd complain.

[debrose]

jillybean, on 2011-December-06, 20:03, said:

Interesting, if a cell phone attracts a full board penalty in the Blue Ribbon I wonder what the other infractions were.
I can ask one of the pairs, they are local players.

Berkowitz and Sontag were penalized because Sontag failed to alert his strong club opening against me (behind screens). It was the first board of the round, and I don't believe I've played against them recently. I momentarily forgot they were playing strong club, and neglected to overcall on a hand with which I clearly would have had I been alerted. They received a better result than they would have if I'd overcalled. The director did not adjust the score, supposedly because I neglected to call the director in a timely enough fashion (I was never alerted, but realized it myself during the auction). I very rarely call the director about anything, and it wasn't until dummy came down that I asked Sontag if he had alerted me. At first I thought I must have just missed the alert. I felt the score should have been adjusted for the offending side, even if not for ours, but the directors chose to only give them this small penalty.

I don't know about any of the other penalties, but I've heard 1/6 of a board is common for slow play.

[jillybean]

debrose, on 2011-December-06, 23:03, said:

Berkowitz and Sontag were penalized because Sontag failed to alert his strong club opening against me (behind screens). It was the first board of the round, and I don't believe I've played against them recently. I momentarily forgot they were playing strong club, and neglected to overcall on a hand with which I clearly would have had I been alerted. They received a better result than they would have if I'd overcalled. The director did not adjust the score, supposedly because I neglected to call the director in a timely enough fashion (I was never alerted, but realized it myself during the auction). I very rarely call the director about anything, and it wasn't until dummy came down that I asked Sontag if he had alerted me. At first I thought I must have just missed the alert. I felt the score should have been adjusted for the offending side, even if not for ours, but the directors chose to only give them this small penalty.

I don't know about any of the other penalties, but I've heard 1/6 of a board is common for slow play.

If I am reading the right law...
Law 21 is quite clear on the procedure after the offending side gain advantage after a failure to alert. I wonder why the TD would decide to give a 1/8 board penalty instead?

Law21 B3 When it is too late to change a call and the Director judges that the offending side gained an advantage from the irregularity, he awards an adjusted score.

[pretzalz]

Mbodell, on 2011-December-06, 19:27, said:

I heard a cell phone go off in day one of the blue ribbon pairs, and I saw a director hurrying in the room. Of course it was the director's phone and he was hurrying out of the playing area to answer it!

I know lots of folks brought their phones to the playing area. I left mine in the hotel room for the days I was playing NABC+ events.

There were penalties handed out in the Blue Ribbon finals, but I'm not sure if they are for slow play, cell phones, or something else.

The recap lists recap:

1 full board penalties to:
Rita Bichara Krzysztof Martens

This was against me. The lady's phone went off 3 times. She didn't know how to turn it off. I didn't actually say anything until she sat there for about 20 seconds and in a seemingly dazed state refused to play the card from dummy that her partner called. At this point I called the director and reported the cell phone which was still lying on top of her bag in an on state. Oh, and all this made us late for the next round despite coming off a hospitality break. And she argued with the director about it. Not sure how much of the penalty was allocated to each offense.

[pretzalz]

pretzalz, on 2011-December-07, 00:13, said:

This was against me. The lady's phone went off 3 times. She didn't know how to turn it off. I didn't actually say anything until she sat there for about 20 seconds and in a seemingly dazed state refused to play the card from dummy that her partner called. At this point I called the director and reported the cell phone which was still lying on top of her bag in an on state. Oh, and all this made us late for the next round despite coming off a hospitality break. And she argued with the director about it. Not sure how much of the penalty was allocated to each offense.

Sorry I was confused. I only played the first day of the Blue Ribbons . It was "Peter Weichsel Rama Linz" that I was referring to who got a full board penalty.

[blackshoe]

Yesterday at the club there was this electronic bell sound. Somebody yelled "somebody shoot that phone!" Turned out it was the director's computer.

[bluecalm]

Imo it should be automatic penalty for cell phone ringing, preferably severe one. Out of simple respect to your opponents you should put it into silent mode.
As to using cell phones at all I think it could go either way, possibly they could be banned at very important events, preventing cheating in popular tournaments is pointless anyway and people like to use their cell phones so I don't mind it unless they ring or people answer calls when at the table.
In chess you lose a game automatically if your cell phone rings even in amateur tournaments and that's much more severe penalty than 3imps, 10 imps or 50 imps in bridge.